You might have learned that if you didnt try to snub total strangers over the internet and instead tried to speak as intelligently as the author just did when he disputed my claims just now. During the 10mm vs .44 Mag. (Another was uncovered after I wrote the last article.) Sorry, theres what you read and then theres real life. I am still looking for some 300 grainers. Gun Watch. That poor bear, he was just turning his life around. The accurate answer is "it depends". When you consider the other factors involved, the 44-magnum may even be a better choice for some than the larger and more powerful calibers. Despite NGs statement about black bears normally running when confronted by a human, do not bet your life on it! SEE IT. Some of these guys are border line genius. Along with delivered energy, we must also consider bullet weight and velocity. That was when I pointed the revolver and fired at center mass. All with hard cast bullets. The major reason is that they dont want to waste expensive ammo on the range. Unless its dead calm, you better be sure you know what direction the wind is blowing. It was a statement that very few of us are in the far north, so very few of us are in the far-north areas where black bears are so much bigger, aggressive, and dangerous. the rifles were left outside the tents, but inside the protective alarm wire. They have been documented stalking humans, attacking without provocation, eating humans they killed and more. Ive watched, while working out, flossing, but never sittingI dont sit while I watch TVpretty much every documentary on bears ever shown, including the one on crazy, brave, brilliant, dead Timothy Treadwell. However, if you are dealing with an especially large or aggressive bear, you may need something more powerful. Grizzly bears can operate much longer that humans due to the way their circulatory system/muscles work. Less felt recoil means a delf defense pistol that many small frame shooters can handle. I could eat a can of alphabet soup and shit out a smarter statement than what you posted !!! For general backpacking in grizzly country, MeatEater Founder Steven Rinella has carried both bear spray and a .44 Magnum revolver. His father has tried in vain to get this sad lad committed to a psychiatric treatment facility for years with zero success. A bear is not a human and self-defense rounds are not as effective on a bear as you might expect. Why wouldnt you choose a long-barreled gun that shoots with higher velocity, better penetration, more accuracy, less muzzle flip, less recoil, and holds one more bullet to stop a charging bear? I APPRECIATE BEARS PLACE IN NATURE, DO NOT HUNT THEM PERSONALLY ( ELK YES, TASTES BETTER TO ME) AND RESPECTFULLY KEEP MY DISTANCE WHEN POSSIBLE. Likely been in a group home since his folks could no longer care for him. . Delivered energy at a given distance, usually measured in ft-lbs. They did not have a .44 magnum. WHEN CLOSE TO HOUSE CHEST RIG WITH SHORT BARREL S/W .44 MAG OR SUPER RED HAWK .44 LONG BARREL. Based on ballistic testing and field use, Nelson recommends Brennekes Black Magic Magnum or DDupleks Monolit 32 solid steel slug. First, I give you credit for confronting a critic, and also for being civil. The result, of course, was the .50 Alaskan. You write em and put your name on em, you have to do that heavy lifting. For example, I said Ive made lower-48 black bears leave my campsites a lot more than 29 times just by sounding irritated. The 9mm can kill bears but is considered underpowered by experienced woodsmen. They know theyre probably going to wind up underneath any grizzly that charges, shot or not. This div height required for enabling the sticky sidebar, 2022 Yestactical.com We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites. Talk about stopping power. Because of this thing called real world experience. They store a lot more oxygen in their muscles than we do. When Jeff Newville faced his moment of truth with the grizzly, he barely had time to fire his revolver. However, bigger is not always better in my opinion. Large caliber handgun ammunition is expensive. It was day 3 of the hunt and we decided to head home due to adverse weather. We have to think. Your fat. Ruger chambers the .454 Casull in both the Super Redhawk with a 4-inch barrel and the Alaskan in a 3-inch variant, both of which are compact and easy to draw when things get up close and personal. But they dont have sense enough to get out of the way of a truck. Center Mass hits can disrupt the circulatory system, but science has proven that enough blood remains in a humans system that they can continue to act for up to about 10 seconds. Grizzlies may become aggressive for a number of reasons. Even in the flawed study Efficacy of firearms for bear deterrence in Alaska the researchers only found 269 attacks in Alaska. of energy at 1500 fps, while the 495-grain DDupleks leaves the muzzle at 1410 fps with 2,180 ft.-lbs. Kinda says what needs to be said comparing us to bears. Go outside and smoke a cigarette or something. I suppose if one hit a bear in the eye with a .22 cal. The rest of the time it stays secure in its holster. The larger the gun, and to some extent, the longer the barrel, the less felt recoil and muzzle flip you will experience. So, people are mauled by bears. I mention this one because of its immense stopping power at extremely close distances. The 44-magnum pistol that I occasionally shoot is a Ruger Super Redhawk Alaskan model. Anybody at all? They made it to a small hunting cabin but went to find some firewood outside and upon opening the door, the bear was going to come in! Keep in mind that you might need a Magnum load to propel a heavy bullet to a decent velocity. https://www.nrafamily.org/articles/2017/7/6/handguns-for-defense-in-bear-country/ If I was in the wilderness thered be a gun on me at all times. akgunners comment HELPS people and makes them smarter. Neither survived. This way it wont hurt you as much when the bear shoves it where the sun dont shine. If we consider only delivered energy, the 44-magnum cartridge resides in the middle of the range that is considered adequate for a bear defense handgun. Do you actually think that you impress anyone by imitating other men? If you live and work in bear country, you know the importance of being prepared for that chance encounter with a bear who has malintent and you for a target. Black bears are responsible for more human deaths and mauling s than griz and brown bear combined! Bears can be very dangerous when theyre angry, so its best to stay out of their reach. So youre absolutely not man enough to admit that you were wrong about the Florida attack, then? You can easily see in this chart how the different calibers using standard factory loads compare in delivered energy down range. Id like to see Boddingtons sources for hundreds of attacks. WTF are you doing using a holster you are not absolutely certain how to operate? Hollywood has done the same thing for other rounds. Polar bear attacks are expected there, and tourists are not allowed unless they carry a high powered firearm. No Time For My 338 or the 12 gauge we had in camp, I got up slowly, turned and fired a shot from my S&W Alaskan Backpacker 44magnum, that was just enough to turn the Big Boar, he leaped the 20 foot distance between us in one bound, and landed just to our left, ( my partner fired ( as the Boar was flying through the air) and hit the Boar, through the the lungs with his Backpacker 44 mag, the Boar hit the ground and leaped away from us, (this would be a V shaped leap) we found him the next morning about 80 yards from camp back in the woods, Dead!! I am looking forward to seeing them. Male grizzlies will defend their territory to the death. If youre ever faced with a bear attack, youll need to know how to defend yourself. Thorofare Country south of Yellowstone, Grizzly at 10 feet, .44 magnum and .357 magnum, September, 2013 (report from 2015) Then at about 2:45 p.m., a collared boar grizzly identified as bear No . Hell, no. AT 1.82 per round, I can afford to go to the range to hone my skills. TWO OR FOUR LEGS , SLITHERS OR SWIMS( ATTACKED BY SHARKS ONCE, HAD .223 BANG STICK THANK YOU VERY MUCH, END OF SHARK AND ATTACK) BE PREPARED. I live in a small native village in bush Alaska. Cause theyd be weaponless from the a _ _ rape theyd get coming through Canada. My hunting friend swears by his Ruger Red Hawk Alaskan. Kim had a Glock model 20 10 mm pistol with him. As stated by Marshall and Sanow in Stopping Power, As a general trend, and all else being equal, stopping power increases as the size of the recovered bullet increases., In addition, their table Caliber Comparison on page 335 shows a significant advantage for .45 ACP over .38.special. The author carries a Glock 17 in 9mm or a Ruger in . In the ever-evolving world of social media, we are constantly looking for new ways to connect with our readers. Sorry Scotty, but you missed again. After all your names not Hank. But while our hands were fresh we shot the revolver first. Would I be able to stop a bear attack if it happened to me? The more energy and penetration the better, provided you dont select a firearm thats too powerful for you to adequately manage. In this case, 44 magnum ammo tends to be much less expensive than the other large specialty calibers of ammunition suitable for bear defense. Some might think about these matters a bit more, so I also wrote some footnotes down below. I come back again to accuracy rather than bullet size. In this blog post, well discuss the importance of having 44 mag ammo for bear protection, and well give you some tips on how to use it effectively. But how much time have you spent in the far northern woods so far in your life?. The Army even ranted against the 30-40 Krag as being ineffective. Clint Eastwood made the 44-magnum cartridge famous with his words Its the most powerful handgun in the world.. I carry both, with bear spray on my left side and a .44 on my right, so IF the bear spray fails Im not completely f-ed. NOT A SHILL FOR BUFFALO BORE, REMINGTON, HORNADY OR WINCHESTER, BLACK HILLS OR OTHERS BUT JUST LIKE THE WAY THEY HAVE ALWAYS HELPED ME SELECT THE PROPER ROUND FOR THE SITUATIONS I WOULD BE IN. {vacant stare}, I have lived and hunted here in Alaska for 40+years, have been face to face with bears here on a few occasions, Black, Brown, Grizzly, And Polar, Every encounter was different, only once, (so far) have I had a have to shoot situation, My hunting partner (from lower 48) and I had boated up a wonderful wilderness river, and everywhere we stopped, was covered with bear tracks, (Grizzly) ( we were Moose hunting) We stopped and made a fire and had dinner, just after dinner (8PM) my partner says BEAR!! I stood in a dumbfounded stupor. 2018 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice and link are included. However, as far as stopping power on even the largest grizzly bear, it delivers enough energy to get the job done. Overall, the 44 magnum revolvers are lighter weight than the larger caliber handguns. Be prepared to take down more than one bear if necessary. Using any handgun is near suicide. Many bear attacks happen in brush where a shorter draw is preferable. Hes read some books so hes an expert. Because of intense interest from his family and friends, Doug wrote a detailed account of the attack and the aftermath. ======================================================================. Any way you slice it, the .357 has proven itself as a worthy close-range bear stopper. A 9, 38, or 45 isnt an adequate round for something as large as a bear, with think hide, fur and muscles. I am thinking I would allways have a friend with me to watch my back, if indeed I was to be in a situation of a bear encroachment. Like the Spartans xiphos blade, the handgun is a much shorter secondary weapon intended for up-close-and-personal encounters. We must not have read the same post. I learned things that could make the difference between success and failure. All in the family wish him nothing but the best, however his violent and irrational demeanor makes him a true pariah and danger to himself and anyone around him. SEEMED GOOD EDUCATION AS MADE IT HOME DUE TO FASTER DRAW AND ONLY 4 HOLES IN ME, MANY MORE IN TWO LEGGED BEARS WITH RED STAR BELT BUCKLES. But energy doesn't kill animals, tissue damage kills them. As Nelson points out, the first shot may end the charge but doesnt always kill the bear, which means its handy to have a rifle that can make the longer follow-up shot. A 12-gauge shotgun and slug will deliver impressive energy and is effective to moderate ranges. It doesnt mean anything. I am skeptical. I use Lyman no. Any large caliber pistol is going to deliver often punishing recoil. Upon second thought, I think you just honestly misunderstood my meaning, and I may have misunderstood yours in the reply I just wrote. Sep 17, 2005. I dont know if I would call it a design. Hence common sense is applied to protect ones self. GRIZZLIES: In the far north, when attacking grizzlies are on sportsmen before they can aim a long gun, they un-chest-holster an big-blast Alaskan snubbie. Good on him for having the clarity of mind to make such a shot, and for having the appropriate ammo in an appropriate caliber such that it could actually travel through a large bear and disrupt the spine and cause such a necessary instantaneous stop. As an avid outdoors person (hunting and fishing mostly)I love to mention and link to various products and gear I use. Unfortunately, most everything else on this page is hogwash! When it comes to defending yourself against a bear attack, theres no substitute for 44 mag ammo. 3) Self defense from a bear attack with a pistol is a cautionary tale at best, correct? Assume those links are affiliate links, which means I may earn a commission if you click and buy. Why dont you get a go pro and hike around grizzly country in the spring season with bear spray and post your live videos. Feel free to reach out to us or read our affiliate disclosure and privacy policy. Someone who hates you. .375 H&H MagnumOne of the original belted, rimless magnum rifle cartridges, Holland & Hollands .375 is not only considered one of the best cartridges for hunting Africa, it also has a proven track record for lethality on large-bodied game in Canada and Alaska, including moose and bear. Lol my dad had one (we lived in southeastern Alaska and he carried it for bear). Next to Bison, they are the second largest cause of fatalities and mauling s in Yellowstone Park. Anyone else? A well placed shot from a .44 Magnum will penetrate both shoulders of a black bear with ease. I prefer to carry a flat nose jacketed bullet. Its the statement of a man who has experience, understanding, and appreciation. Although I seldom agreed with Jeff Cooper he was right when he said that if you use a handgun as an offensive weapon its tantamount to committing suicide no matter what the caliber. Timothy Treadwell and his girlfriend Amie Huguenard were killed in an unprovoked grizzly attack in Alaska on October 6th, 2003. How many people were attacked by humans in the last 40 years? Now theres some first-class thinking Thats the reason why infantrymen have left their rifles back at camp when they go into battle for the last thousand years. The dog did nothing more than backup, sneeze, and trot away. At anytime I can simply reach forward, undo the straps, grab my rifle and Im good to go, or so I thought. Im pretty sure, he would say, the gun is only as good as the person handling it. Since the bear usually knows where you are long before you are aware of the bear, your reaction time may be considerably less than 4.5 seconds. .357 S&W MagnumWhile some folks claim the .44 Magnum is the minimum for charging bears, many others have opted for a Glock 20 in 10mm Auto and, interestingly enough, passed right by the .357 S&W Magnum. Bear Gun Shootout: The .44 Magnum. Yet the .500 Smith & Wesson Magnum handgun produces 2,254 ft.-lbs. The cause and the effect of the .44 shot is obvious in the video. Well thought-out, well-researched, and well-said. That means having the right gear, and knowing how to use it. His backup in case of a bear attack is a 500 S&W. Mostly considered a revolver cartridge, the .44 Magnum is often chambered in rifles. Its also been incredibly popular among Alaskan hunters and guides, especially in lever-actions like Marlins 1895 Guide Gun, which is compact, fairly lightweight and highly maneuverable in close quarters. Please send your references, links preferred. We better remember that when we are out where the truly strong are. Your cigarettes. Wow dude, for real? You criticize Dean, he responds and asks you to provide a source for your criticism, and then you refuse, and do so in a self-righteous manner? Bear will win every time. 44 Magnum ammo should do the trick though! of energy, while 1,000 ft/lbs is considered the minimum for a bear hunting gun. Backpack straps and holstered guns dont get along well. However, if you are dealing with an especially large or aggressive bear, you may need something more powerful. I doubt any bear could withstand two quick rounds from this one to the head! Having shot a 44 magnum numerous times, I can tell you that it is not one of my favorite range guns. When hunting black bear, use a rifle with good sights and a scope. Global warming? Among firearms platforms, a rifle delivers more energy and is effective to greater distances, making it the first choice. Grizzly bears enter a state of hyperphagia in the fall, a condition that provokes gluttony in preparation for winter hibernation. This weight advantage may amount to only a few ounces on a fully loaded pistol, but after eight hours of up and down mountains on foot tracking an elk or mountain goat, even a few ounces can make a difference. You should instead be astonished of its success and dominance instead of blaming it on things like youre made up fake news. The article was about pistols being used to defend against bears. Sure makes it shorter and lighter, easier to carry and draw. Remember that handguns are not as powerful as rifles and may not provide enough penetration on larger bears. Some others are .50 Desert Eagle, .454 Casull, .500 Smith & Wesson Magnum and the .480 Ruger. .454 Casull Developed by Dick Casull and Jack Fulmer in 1957, the .454 Casull is a dangerous game hunters dream come true. here: Live survive love laugh and be happy, not screaming in terror before dying in pain, 7mm Remington Magnum (168gr Nosler AccuBond LR at 2,880fps): 19.6 Your gun needs to be accessible and not overly retained. LOL . Your drugs. Buffalo Bore produces several loads for the .50 Alaskan, including a 450-grain bullet that delivers a whopping 4,400 ft.-lbs. Caliber: .44 Magnum. has killed its fair share of charging bears. When I worked as a hunting guide, my boss introduced me to our hunters as PETA Joe, do to my love of critters, I dont trust bears, theyre hard to make friends with. We would like to show you a description here but the site won't allow us. 10 BEST PADDLE BOARD AND KAYAK COMBOS 2023 WITH BUYING GUIDE, Grizzly 300 Grain Cast lead bullet wide flat nose, Buffalo Bore 300-grain hard cast flat nose bullet, Buffalo Bore 300 grain jacketed flat nose. (Its the one with the 18:26 time-stamp). I havent seen anyone advocate using a pistol as an offensive weapon for bears in this thread, or in the article, it is specifically about using a pistol as a defensive weapon on a charging bear. Chuke tests 44 Mag and 10mm Underwood Extreme Penetrator on his actual Grizzly Bear Skull to dispel the urban myth that a bears skull will ward off these kin. What did work was the short barrel shotgun. It dispels the notion that pistols are useless as a defense. When one of us has an animal down, one guts, the other stays ready for a bear. The 44 magnum is no exception. Holy shit you have some serious issues. You have to do more than say there are books out there, you have to read em. You criticize Dean for his 30 cases, all of which are sourced, yet you flat out refuse to source your own claims. But I can count em well enough to know it was a lot more than the tiny sample of 29 that he cherry-picked to scare you. No, but if he cant get his long gun out its better than a knife or bare hands (pardon the pun). A charging grizzly bear can reach speeds of 35 mph an hour for short distances and their acceleration rate is phenomenal. It would have been just as inaccessible while my body was pumping with adrenaline. I believe I said the other day, .44 Rem Mag FTW! .30-06 and.300 Win were the results. He plainly states that he was researching attacks where pistols where used in defense. In general, you should always try to avoid any conflict with bears if possible. The beauty of the .454, however, is that you can practice with .45 Colt rounds and save yourself a bit of recoil trauma. While it is extremely effective, the main reason its been so widely-used is because shotguns like the Remington 870 and Mossberg 500 are a fraction of the price of bolt-guns and, in turn, thats what the government has provided to its employees. However, Ive learned a few things. The first time a strong cross wind completely redirected the spray 90degrees to the side. .45-70 GovernmentFirst adopted by the U.S. military in 1873, the .45-70 Government has been one of the longest-standing big-game cartridges of all time. .338 Winchester Magnum The favorite among Alaskan guides as a backup gun, the .338 Winchester Magnum was released in 1958 as belted, rimless cartridge. A JSP bullet at a velocity that will completely penetrate the chest of an average-size bear is probably a better choice than a hardcast SWC solid. I DO NOT BELIEVE SPRAY THAT EFFECTIVE. Elevated them to cult status, whether they deserve it or not. It was pretty much a niche round til Dirty Harry. Putting aside your irrelevant propagandizing about the Philippine insurrection, there is clear evidence that when comparing ball ammo, the .45 ACP is better than the .38 special and the .45 Long Colt was better than the .38 Long Colt. Ive also bothered to read Weingartens stuff for years. . The short barrel makes this pistol quick and easy to draw and maneuver, it is lighter than most other 44 magnum revolvers. test, none of us were looking forward to running the S&W 329 PD with the Hornady 240-grain JHP loads I had brought along. photo from thetruthaboutguns.com. Since hes a doc, his wifes a doc and their hunting buddies are all doctors and/or veterinarians Im just going to assume they know what theyre on about. Of which he found 29 accounts. Woot! NOT UNUSUAL TO HAVE BEARS CLOSE TO CABIN EATING BERRIES OR GETTING A DRINK. Take your time in selecting a shot and make sure to take into account distance, windage, and elevation. Down in the article a little ways Paco talks about his bear kill. Sherman, set the wayback machine for September 7th, 2006. Weight X Velocity X Diameter /7000 = TKOF Does a 44 Magnum rifle kick? He was about ten feet away coming up and over the initial log that I had tripped over. Will a 44 Magnum stop a grizzly bear? Can a .44 Magnum L5 Desert Eagle stop a Bear attack? 44 Magnum ammo should do the trick though! Elmer Keith developed it to hunt AK Brown bears. So, I asked about this. Best thing in the world? Considered by many to be the minimum for big bear defense rounds, the .44 Remington Magnum was first introduced in 1955 for revolvers and gained widespread popularity in the 1970s thanks to Dirty Harry. Youve all read how much ground a bear can cover in a few seconds..he kept his cool and did everything right once the holster fiasco was passed. Im not criticizing him for that, but he didnt say it was his research. Big credit to the guy finding his calm in that situation; it allowed him to place a well aimed shot . No big bears. 2) lots of bear attack stories lately. This powerful ammunition can help you take down even the biggest bears. Over thousands of generations that adds up. Proper 9mm bullets yield sufficient penetration in soft tissue, but it may not stop a bear quickly enough to avoid being mauled. Did you ever even bother to check on last weeks bear attack in Florida after I said you were wrong? COPYRIGHT 2021, THETRUTHABOUTGUNS.COM. My uncle Dale dropped a charging sow with a neck shot at the same distance with a s&w 629. According to Hornady's data, the XTP bullets from a 7.5-inch barrel clock at 1350 fps and generate . For me, the pros outweigh the cons enough to make a 44 magnum my choice of bear country pistols. They routinely feed on the gut piles of hunter-killed elk and, along with their cousins Alaska brown bears, are known to try to claim carcasses from hunters. What happened? So that makes two attacks on humans. .300 Remington Ultra Magnum (180gr Nosler Partition at 3,243fps)(4,202 ft lbs): 25.7 . Hes in a medical field, Id really like to know if he noticed any hearing damage after 4-5 rounds of *big boom*. JUST CALLED THEM ON THE PHONE AND MOST HELPFUL. Thanks for visiting eatingthewild.com. This is really what the .44 mag was designed for., Yup. I wonder what Larry Kelly would have to say about the negative talk here about the Magnaport Stalker handguns that his company builtand he took to Alaska and the African continent to do his testing with it way back in the late 70s or 80s. When youre out in the wild, its important to be prepared for anything. People arent buying snubbies in big calibers for this kind of situation any more than theyre buying large knives because they want to join that one guy who actually did kill a grizzly with a Ka-Bar. Keep your gun on your hip and always designate one to watch for bears. I bothered to read the articles about last weeks the bear attack in Florida, unlike you. I see youre suddenly changing from Jesse Pinkman language to an exact imitation of Donald Trump-tweet language.Why? In 1984, Winchester began to produce rifles chambered for cartridge, legitimizing Waters dream, and establishing it as a commercial cartridge. grains X muzzle FPS X inches /7000. Biologically, grizzly bears are omnivores and will eat almost anything they come across. I can't imagine anyone feeling comfortable packing a .44 mag. As he fell, he bit at the ground and ended up with a mouthful of sod.
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